New Password part 2

[Esk8]

I think the main problem here about how testing doesnt really work is that there's people we might not want to play with that could still pass the test.

[SicK]

Well ve some fresh blood but i agreewe still need more and more since it is !2010! already thats impresive some new guys are still comin^^ It is like i ask myself a question" would i start th3 in 2010 if i wont start th2demo in 2000late/early 2001?" The anserw ofc would be no fckin way. Idk i really like to play this game from time to time still with some old good friends. I am a lot less serious about it for sure tho and idk if we really ve to be that serious/official still as plum mentioned. We really will need a good topic to discuss this new pw once for good. I am writing those posts while i dont really ve much time for it. Good discusion with 2 teams pros and cons is wat we need<not to kill new pw idea but just to make it better>, i guess?

[Lyst]

First of all I think a new password is really needed. People might be friendly, but people in the noobservers are friendly too (except for the kicks you get for scoring more than 3 mil). The point is, the newest generation, with that i mean players who joined the procommunity in 2009, is really too weak imo. A full 100% of them got the password through chat/internet/friends. There was never any skill involved there. This truely disadvantages people who want to get the password in a fair way. We didn't let (barely) anyone join the community during the past 2-3 years, ever asked yourself why? Because there are already so much new people getting into the proservers that you don't want even more players to join the community. When I host with t, I expect people to be able to be a proper game of ctf/cz. Ofcourse they don't need to be fuckin good etc etc. But he should be able to give some good games. That's a point where you get to respect player skills. The newest generation clearly misses that skill. They join the t-server with new people every day. No one greeting eachother, talking happens in own language with their friends only. To be short, it is simply not possible to play some good games in the current t-servers, if there is 1 or more players from the newest generation around, that makes good people leave thps, because it's boring now and it is for me (and I think I can speak for a lot more) the reason there should be a new password.

Second, the part that we don't need a test. First of all we made this test, so everybody had a fair chance to join the new community. Only thing they got discriminated at was their skill (which is a fair point when you create a PRO-community). We ignored all personal relations we had with the people we tested, just to show we want to make a good procommunity again where our opinion about some players doesn't count.
Now you say we don't need that test, it could be a good point. But then you also have to defend your way of giving the password.
- First of all, who is allowed to give the password?
Is it the testing team we have now? Well they are capable at judging the skill of people properly, but will people, who are not big friends with any of these 10 players, have any chance in obtaining the new password?
Or do you want everyone in the community being able to give the password to people they think deserve it. The problem here is the main problem of the current password too. 1. The definition of pro, becomes lower with every new guy. If this new guy invites someone again according to his definition of pro, it can be even lower. 2. What's the definition of pro? Can everyone have his own definition? So one can't join from fatguy for example, but according to rey he can join.
- Second, how does this improve the current situation?
Well we don't have to do tests anymore, but we still have to judge people on their skill and if we can "trust" them. In that case we still have that one player who helped build the old community, who we can't really trust. So that doesn't solve anything. The angry american will still be angry, because now everyone gets free passes. So those things you don't solve with it. The chance the password will leak is even higher, since there is no definition anymore.
- Third, how will you defend the fact you're trying to create a community to your likings with your friens, like you're the god of THPS?
- Fourth, how can the new people become friends with the pro's, they can't even join the servers. While with tests, the new player only needs to speak to someone one time, to request a test.

And to finish this long story, afair d & d are older passwords than t, t was made since thps4/thug? And that story about friends is true, only now it is: friends of friends of friends of friends of friends of friends. Where ther first 3 generations already left and every generation getting weaker and weaker.

[Lyst]

And is it a coincedence or are all non cz/ctf players against the password?
- Plum
- S4L
- Shifty
- Stof
- Nihilism

[plum]

lyst Wrote:First of all I think a new password is really needed. People might be friendly, but people in the noobservers are friendly too (except for the kicks you get for scoring more than 3 mil). The point is, the newest generation, with that i mean players who joined the procommunity in 2009, is really too weak imo. A full 100% of them got the password through chat/internet/friends. There was never any skill involved there. This truely disadvantages people who want to get the password in a fair way. We didn't let (barely) anyone join the community during the past 2-3 years, ever asked yourself why? Because there are already so much new people getting into the proservers that you don't want even more players to join the community. When I host with t, I expect people to be able to be a proper game of ctf/cz. Ofcourse they don't need to be fuckin good etc etc. But he should be able to give some good games. That's a point where you get to respect player skills. The newest generation clearly misses that skill. They join the t-server with new people every day. No one greeting eachother, talking happens in own language with their friends only. To be short, it is simply not possible to play some good games in the current t-servers, if there is 1 or more players from the newest generation around, that makes good people leave thps, because it's boring now and it is for me (and I think I can speak for a lot more) the reason there should be a new password.

That's your server, your opinion? Are we going to mess with communality bc of you? For you they may lack skills but for some no or some may don't care. You should know that this is not We and They (people lacking skills). Everyone is part of community.

BTW foreign languages.
You are not going to change peoples attitude. I remember you talking dutch in so don't blame other people for doing that. You also were consider as a no so good player . When they pass test they will probably still speak foreign languages.

lyst Wrote:Second, the part that we don't need a test. First of all we made this test, so everybody had a fair chance to join the new community. Only thing they got discriminated at was their skill (which is a fair point when you create a PRO-community). We ignored all personal relations we had with the people we tested, just to show we want to make a good procommunity again where our opinion about some players doesn't count.
Now you say we don't need that test, it could be a good point. But then you also have to defend your way of giving the password.
- First of all, who is allowed to give the password?
Is it the testing team we have now? Well they are capable at judging the skill of people properly, but will people, who are not big friends with any of these 10 players, have any chance in obtaining the new password?
Or do you want everyone in the community being able to give the password to people they think deserve it. The problem here is the main problem of the current password too. 1. The definition of pro, becomes lower with every new guy. If this new guy invites someone again according to his definition of pro, it can be even lower. 2. What's the definition of pro? Can everyone have his own definition? So one can't join from fatguy for example, but according to rey he can join.
- Second, how does this improve the current situation?
Well we don't have to do tests anymore, but we still have to judge people on their skill and if we can "trust" them. In that case we still have that one player who helped build the old community, who we can't really trust. So that doesn't solve anything. The angry american will still be angry, because now everyone gets free passes. So those things you don't solve with it. The chance the password will leak is even higher, since there is no definition anymore.
- Third, how will you defend the fact you're trying to create a community to your likings with your friens, like you're the god of THPS?
- Fourth, how can the new people become friends with the pro's, they can't even join the servers. While with tests, the new player only needs to speak to someone one time, to request a test.

You are trying to do that, bc you are not happy. Another thing is test team. They are acting like gods. They are only people who can give pass. I remember someone asking wild for test. Wild said that something like (not exact words): You really want me to test you? You are probably not going to pass it or it will be very hard. Ask someone else.


Is that fair testing? That guy just didn't want to be tested anymore after hearing that. Very immature behavior from wild.

lyst Wrote:And to finish this long story, afair d & d are older passwords than t, t was made since thps4/thug? And that story about friends is true, only now it is: friends of friends of friends of friends of friends of friends. Where ther first 3 generations already left and every generation getting weaker and weaker.

Weren't tXo created at thps4? You are getting better and better after 7 years of playing . I know how much you improved since the first time I've seen you. 8-)


Anyway it seems like you and your test team have monopole to make all decisions in your secret forum. So good luck!

[Lyst]

Quote:That's your server, your opinion? Are we going to mess with communality bc of you? For you they may lack skills but for some no or some may don't care. You should know that this is not We and They (people lacking skills). Everyone is part of community.

I'm only allowed to talk for myself, that's why I use "I". This has been an issue since and maybe even before blu. I remember we wanted to change the password at the bluforum, but passwords were always doomed to fail. So this scenario isn't from my eyes only. In fact many players left the community, because of this problem. And to pick a current example, ownish wanted to stop with thps3, but came back because of the password. I'm kinda sick of that "because of you want it like that" argument, that's the reason i used it for your idea.
And "everyone is part of the community", everyone? why are we hosting with a password then? I mean isn't the password used to exclude people from the community?

Quote:You are trying to do that, bc you are not happy. Another thing is test team. They are acting like gods. They are only people who can give pass. I remember someone asking wild for test. Wild said that something like (not exact words): You really want me to test you? You are probably not going to pass it or it will be very hard. Ask someone else.

Would you not generalize wild as the whole testingteam, I can't remember I've been unfriendly/arrogant to anyone who tried to do the test. And I agree, wild can be more helpfull in such situations.

Quote:Weren't tXo created at thps4? You are getting better and better after 7 years of playing . I know how much you improved since the first time I've seen you. 8-)

Well yes, because I played in those 7 years. But the friends of friends ... of friends didn't play in 2002 nor 2003 nor .. nor 2007. In fact they got the password from friends who got it from friends etc. For someone who just joins the procommunity, his definition of pro is lower than people who are in it for years and seen many people. So if this new player invites people who he thinks are pro or are his friend, the average skill of the new players will go down relatively compared to the players who played longer.

Quote:Anyway it seems like you and your test team have monopole to make all decisions in your secret forum. So good luck!

If there was a monopoly, then these suggestions would never have been discussed and just plainly ignored. I like that people help to think with us to make the community better. But I also defend the current project, because most critics at this project are based on lies. And other critics I managed to avoid, by making it so that it's good for everyone, are still counting for your plan of having no tests at all. I'm just pointing you to the facts we had to go through at the beginning at this project. If you have a solution for those critics and for the current critics, then you have a better plan than us and we will be glad to do your plan.
ps. the testing team is also carefully chosen from people who are in different clans and have different views about the password also. It's not like I chose my 9 best friends to get into the testingteam. They're chosen at their capability to judge skills.

[plum]

Quote:If there was a monopoly, then these suggestions would never have been discussed and just plainly ignored. I like that people help to think with us to make the community better. But I also defend the current project, because most critics at this project are based on lies. And other critics I managed to avoid, by making it so that it's good for everyone, are still counting for your plan of having no tests at all. I'm just pointing you to the facts we had to go through at the beginning at this project. If you have a solution for those critics and for the current critics, then you have a better plan than us and we will be glad to do your plan.
ps. the testing team is also carefully chosen from people who are in different clans and have different views about the password also. It's not like I chose my 9 best friends to get into the testingteam. They're chosen at their capability to judge skills.

What exactly wasn't true? :|

When I said community I meant everyone is or was playing on regular basics. These people know pws.

And yes were are allowed to have opinions, but at the end test team make decisions, for example giving free pass etc.

Anyway this is my last post regarding this issue.

[wild786]

plum Wrote:

Quote:You are trying to do that, bc you are not happy. Another thing is test team. They are acting like gods. They are only people who can give pass. I remember someone asking wild for test. Wild said that something like (not exact words): You really want me to test you? You are probably not going to pass it or it will be very hard. Ask someone else.


Is that fair testing? That guy just didn't want to be tested anymore after hearing that. Very immature behavior from wild.

u missed some KEY words and without KEY words you change the meaning of what i said, i said he won't pass it if he takes the test from ME, not that he wont pass the test, and yes it's completely fair testing because that is my personal attitude BEFORE the test began. all i was doing is giving him a suggestion, his goal was to pass the test and i was giving him advice on how to do that. its not like i refused to give him the test

[stof]

OT
theres alot of words here oO

[Vadru]

lyst Wrote:And is it a coincedence or are all non cz/ctf players against the password?
- Plum
- S4L
- Shifty
- Stof
- Nihilism

hmm not so strange maybe they can't cz or ctf but are really god at combo games and also wanna be called pro and be in pro comunity so a sulotion for that could be to creat 2 passwords one for combo and one for cz ctf koth if you pass the 7 xtc you can get the combo password if you pass the koth cz you can get the other password and if you pass all you can get all passwords just a sugestion :roll: but also i see not only non cz players complain tho shifty play cz sometimes and esk8 seems to be a cz player too its just this ppl who can only pass half the test or that passed the test but dont like the idea that are complaining i think